CouncillorsParish Council - Meetings minutes
15 May 2008 - 8pm
HIGHWAYS & TRANSPORTATION COMMITTEE
8.00 p.m. on 15 May 2008
Village Hall Committee Room
Minutes
Present: Councillors: - Ken Huddart (Chairman), Anthony Sheppard, David Parks, Jimmy Cartwright, Geoff Herbert
Co-opted members: Howard Mallinson, Brian Rhodes, Caroline Stevenson
In attendance: Parish Clerk- Freda Collins
Matthew Winnie SW Trains Area manager
Alison Local Station manager
Cllr Mike Bennison
1. Apologies for absence
None
2. Declarations of Interest in items on the Agenda
Cllr Parks declared that he is a governor of Claygate Primary School.
Cllr Cartwright declared that he is also a Borough Councillor.
The Chairman changed the order of the meeting to take item 6 b & c and invited Matthew Winnie and Alison to take part in the discussion. Cllr Huddart had previously circulated discussion items to SW Trains
CPC discussion point:-
The congregation of youth at Claygate Station can be off putting for some travellers, particularly at night. Unacceptable ball games and drinking have occurred, the latter being effectively tackled by the Police Community Support Officer. There is need for evidence that the SWT CCTV is effective. Youths use the trains as a free service and go around causing vandalism. At one stage a youth who was residing in Claygate contacted other youths by means of a mobile phone. They gathered in the village and caused trouble. Luckily, he no longer lives in the village. Claygate has an excellent PCSO who has a good rapport with our young people. We note that the area of the station which used to be used for drinking has now been fenced off.
SW Train answer:-
Three-quarters of the network is linked to the Wimbledon Centre, but Claygate is not included. Claygate does have a CCTV system which is monitored by the Ticket Clerk. He will only review the tapes if he is made aware of an incident. A new grade of staff has been introduced; Rail Community Officers who are accredited and have a power of arrest. They work out of a new base at Raynes Park. They are controlled by the British Rail Police but are tasked by feedback and crime figures, so are influenced by SW Trains needs. There is a Neighbourhood Policing scheme based at Clapham. Stations are not manned 24 per day, but all trains are manned and if an incident is spotted at a station, then staff will react. The emergency help buttons on the platforms override all other calls going into the centre. A member of the public seeing an incident should go through to the Customer Service Centre or press the emergency button.
Any information about occurrences at the station are logged by the Ticket Clerk and passed onto the Area Manager.
More barriers are being introduced which should cut down on the ‘free’ travel of youths.
CPC discussion point:-
We would like to see longer staffing hours.
SW Train answer:-
Every community also wants this. SW Trains are able to monitor ticket sales on an hourly basis. Using this information, after hours sales do not warrant a member of staff. Practically, the toilet and waiting room can only be open when the station is staffed.
CPC discussion point:-
It was noted that Dave, the Ticket Clerk, will retire in 8 weeks time. When Dave has been away before, the stand-ins seem to be poorly trained.
SW Train answer:-
All employees should have the same basic training, If there are any problems please feed them back to Alison.
CPC discussion point:-
There are queues at the ticket office and the only ticket machine, particularly on Monday mornings, when some passengers' requirements are time-consuming. These queues are not cleared by the time the train arrives; so many passengers have to board the train without a ticket, with the obvious implications for revenue and cannot buy season tickets. The situation was exacerbated during recent renovations when the ticket office was totally closed, so that passengers could not buy tickets in advance. We understand that a second ticket machine is planned, which would be very welcome; could you please confirm when it will be installed
SW Train answer:-
Matthew Winnie replied that the second machine had not been decided. SW Trains are investigating other ways of buying tickets such as on-line or a pay-as-you-go card (similar to Oyster). It is hoped that a smart-card system will be operational in about 18 months.
CPC discussion point:-
The scope of the ticket machines is limited; will they be made more flexible.
SW Train answer:-
A new facility, a basket function, has just been introduced. New software has been introduced and more is coming in which will enable advance ticket purchase.
CPC discussion point:-
The station car park ticket machine has been out of action for months. Passengers are therefore inconvenienced by having to visit the ticket office where they have to queue and add to queues for other passengers. From the Parish Council's point of view the inconvenience to motoring passengers increases the temptation for them to park on street, which is a serious problem in Claygate. The machine was repaired at the end of April.
SW Train answer:-
The machines are well past their sell-by date and there is no maintenance contract. SW Trains are looking at other options for ticket purchase, such as through mobile phones. It is hoped that these machines will be replaced by something more fit for purpose.
CPC discussion point:-
The car park seems to be more heavily used.
SW Train answer:-
Car park surveys are regular carried out and this has not been noted, although generally, the use of the car parks has increased due to increased rail use. SW Trains has a franchise commitment to provide 2000 more spaces. Some car parks are being turned into 2 storeys.
CPC discussion point:-
As the car park is never full, is there a chance that the fees will be reduced? Claygate is one of the few stations on the new line where there is free, proximate on-street parking. Commuters drive into Claygate to park on our streets. This is not popular with residents, so we would like to see car park fees as low as possible to keep as many cars as possible in the car park.
SW Train answer:-
The fees will not be reduced. The prices are reviewed every year and are based on usage, availability of other car parks and the type of area. The fees are below that of NCP.
CPC discussion point:-
The station car park has two notices advising that parking is free at weekends. However, the recently "updated" version restricts this freedom to rail users, contrary to the long-standing agreement that it should be free to all users, so as to reduce obstructive parking in The Parade on Saturdays. We have asked for corroboration about the agreement from the Chamber of Commerce, but not received it. I shall be able to provide email correspondence over several years with SWT at Overline House, which accepted the position and got the signs changed at our request several times.
SW Train answer:-
SW Trains has no knowledge of any such agreement. It was pointed out that anyone checking the car park will not know if the owner of a car parked there is a shopper or a rail user. But for those who do not like breaking rules, Alison will investigate the problem.
CPC discussion point:-
There is a need to modernise the Gents toilet.
SW Train answer:-
Station maintenance is carried out centrally, but this is not on the current list. All they could promise is that the toilets will be painted and kept clean.
CPC discussion point:-
There is an appreciation of the impact of the new timetables (changed Dec 2004) in securing more consistent service. But there is a concern at the lack of a through train service to Waterloo on Sunday mornings. We considered that competing lines had more than one service an hour, so there was scope for Claygate to have just one within the known maintenance restriction for the track section from Surbiton to Waterloo. The answer was that the competing lines e.g. Kingston, can be busy on Sundays. It was noted that works are starting to impinge on Saturdays as well, so that we no longer have a 7-day a week service. If these works have a horizon, this can be accepted, if the situation will be forever then it is unacceptable.
SW Train answer:-
The reason is that Network Rail is carrying out necessary engineering works. There has been a positive impact on the service where upgrades have taken place.
CPC discussion point:-
There is concern at the missing 0834 UP service stopping at Wimbledon, Clapham and Vauxhall (important interchanges). We do however agree that the replacement fast service is popular and should be retained, if a choice has to be made.
SW Train answer:-
It is not possible to add another train because the throat at Clapham Junction is already at maximum.
CPC discussion point:-
What is the situation with regard to car wash in the station car park, and the signs which remain even though the service has stopped?
SW Train answer:-
The contractor’s service was not up to standard at Claygate and elsewhere, so authority has not been granted; the signs should be removed.
The Chairman thanked Matthew and Alison for attending the meeting and all agreed that it had been very useful. Alison stated that they had useful feedback as station management is reactive. They will send us the relevant contact numbers and Alison will investigate the replacement of the bin on the ‘up’ line
They left the meeting and the normal order of the agenda resumed.
3. Minutes of the last Meeting
The minutes of the previous meeting on the 21 Feb 2008 had been circulated.
They were agreed and signed.
4. The Constitution of the Committee
Nothing to report.
5. To report on the actioning of items from previous minutes.
AP58 Consultation on bus/rail interaction. Anthony Sheppard compiled the following responses
To the current consultation on 'Options for Strengthening Bus Passenger Representation'.
1. Response to Q1a, 2a. Additional consultative bodies should only be created where a clear benefit to the public can be demonstrated, not just because a similar industry has such a body. Many of the most controversial issues relating to the provision of bus services arise at a relatively local level. This suggests that building on the existing Bus Passengers UK (Option 1) may be the best solution, as this already has a regional focus.
2. Response to Q1b. If any of the proposed options is adopted, the opportunity should be taken to facilitate consideration of road-rail coordination issues at the level of national passenger representation in conjunction with the parallel rail passenger body, perhaps via Joint Working Party. For the reasons noted above (1), we do not favour the creation of a new multi-modal public transport body.
They were sent by email on 14/3/08 to buses@dft.gsi.gov.uk
AP59 Station ticket machines. Item 6b Email discussion with Matthew Winnie, who will be at the meeting.
AP60 Item 7a. Cllr Huddart to request date for work on Albany Crescent. This was reported early, and SCC is working on it internally. Some of the lines have been repainted in Cornwall Avenue.
AP61 Proposed footpath in Telegraph Lane. No action has yet been taken to notify resident that we do not recommend a formal footway in the missing section.
AP62 Item 7a. Committee members to report patterns of overhanging vegetation. No reports received. Because some items of overhanging vegetation could not wait till the end of May, Cllr Huddart reported them to SCC this week.
AP63 Item 7c. Woodstock Lane Triangle underground services survey Formal advice was made available to Anthony Sheppard, who has produced sketches and further advice for the contractor.
AP64 Item 7e. Concern that the lack of flow of information between the street lighting contractors is causing serious safety issues. Action with David Munro not taken, but other reports and responses exchanged with SCC. Zebra crossing is now lit to acceptable standard. 23 Claremont Road was further delayed because work was unsuccessful, but is now lit.
AP65 Item 8. Paper for VDS, including red-brick paving. No report.
AP66 Item 9. Parking reports to SCC. No responses received.
AP67 Item 10 Conclusions on Traffic calming.
AP68 Item 13. Dirty street nameplates. No information received. Cllr Huddart will check if EBC received his email.
6. Public Transport
One political circulation said that it would do more to provide a bus service suitable for residents in Ruxley. Cllr Huddart is fearful that this could complicate the K3 service and conflict with our policy of building on its recent improvement and growth of patronage. It also opens up debate on whether the “Claygate loop” (which serves the Common Road stop, the nearest to Ruxley) should be retained. A discussion took place about additions to the K3 route such as Ruxley and Coverts Road. It was agreed that there would have to be evidence of a demand from these areas, because the addition to the route would make it unwieldy and slow, and so reduce usefulness. It was noted that the ‘daily shop’ is a thing of the past as many products keep for longer. Claygate Care has now closed, but Elmbridge Community Transport is useful for people without their own transport.
a. Bus shelters & Routes
Bus shelter at the Recreation Ground-
This still needs repainting and coating in Graffiti Shield
AP69 Cllr Parks to action
Bus shelter at Common Road-
No report
Bus shelter at the village hall- The bus shelter at the Village Hall has been vandalised twice recently. The first went unrepaired for several weeks; because EBC was not informed, but took prompt action when told. More recently, Cllr Huddart reported the destroyed panel promptly and it was repaired within days. Yellow paint has been put on the roof and the adjacent telephone booth and timetable have been subject to graffiti.
AP70 The Clerk to report to EBC
Post meeting note: reported and dealt with
b. Trains
Already dealt with
c. Claygate Station
Already dealt with
7. Liaison with SCC
a. Road Maintenance and Footpaths, including Telegraph Lane
It is now known that SCC have not taken action over the road markings in Albany Crescent as its records are incorrect and will need to be amended. It was noted that we could demand that SCC produce the original order under the Freedom of Information Act. Alternatively, the order would have been published in the Esher News & Mail, so back-records could be checked.
AP71 Cllr Huddart will chase
Raleigh Drive is still shown as being on the programme for surface treatment (Post-meeting notes-Cllr Bennsion stated that this is because further work will take place; further work carried out on 22 May)
Cllr Parks is annoyed because of the incompetent way in which the work to Cornwall Avenue took place. The resurfacing took place without notice, so a car parked on the road could not be moved, so the resurfacing took place around it and the white lines have still not been completed. The lines at the top of the road have been reinstated, but not at the bottom. If the remedial work is not completed within 2 weeks he intends to personally write to the press about the waste of public money.
b. Replacement Highway Trees
Our replacement tree programme was completed in January. Certain items had to be left over for this year. New suggestions are needed now.
Claygate in Bloom has been active in taking over some parts of highway verge in the High Street and at Torrington Lodge (where the planting has been very attractive). Cllr Huddart has assisted by obtaining SCC’s agreement to plant, in respect of protection of underground services. The notice given by CIB has generally been seriously inadequate, and Cllr Huddart had to take risks in authorising action before the documentation was available. Regrettably the contractor seems not to have appreciated the need to behave sensitively. Last month there has been a request to include the north verge of Rosehill. Cllr Huddart refused on the grounds of past experience of confusion over land ownership and disagreements between neighbours, and also that he thought that we were making too many piecemeal approaches to SCC. In future he plans to require at least three months notice of any of these requests, and for a single programme for the year, if the PC is to be involved.
Councillors were asked to report incidences of lateral growth. SCC will attend to these if there are many in one area, such as the trees at the top of Oaken Lane, or a number within the village.
A discussion took place about the feasibility of taking over the maintenance of Highway trees from SCC; this would include replacement, pollarding and keeping tidy. A contractor would need to be employed and a grant obtained from SCC. Graham Banks has reported that he is catching up on necessary work, but this usually means felling. It was agreed that the Committee is sympathetic to this scheme and will discuss again.
c. Woodstock Lane Triangle underground services survey
AP63 – a site meeting took place and Cllr Huddart provided formal advice made available to Anthony Sheppard, who has produced sketches and further advice for the contractor. He should report on his actions to define the area of cobbles required, and to secure sensitive action by the contractor. Andy has acknowledged receipt of the report, but no firm date for the work has been set.
d. Safe Routes to School
The old gateway will be opened. No date has been received for work on the new pathway.
e. Street Lighting
On 13 Apr 08, Cllr Huddart reported to East Surrey Highways that the following street lights and sign lights were out until during last week and are still likely to be out. He noted that he had given reference numbers allocated this year, but others are still more out-of-date, and still unrepaired:-
i. The Causeway, junction with Church Road. The two bollards have become detached and are out of lighting. Youths leave them in the road. You may have responsibility for any resultant accident.
ii. 14 The Parade, street light out. Your ref. 92014787 allocated 07 Feb 08
iii. Zebra crossing in Hare Lane at The Parade. West side spotlight out. Older report than this year. East side beacon out, possibly newer report. Pedestrians very difficult to see.
You may have responsibility for any resultant accident.
iv. Hare Lane opposite The Parade at south end of service road, western No Entry sign light is out. Your ref. 92014787 allocated on 7 Jan 08, but report is very much older.
v. High Street, sign for Hare Lane mini-roundabout is not lit. Your ref. 92013786 allocated on 7 Jan 08
vi. The Green, lights for the mini-roundabout sign, the humps warning sign and the fountain are out. Your ref 92013783 allocated on 7 Jan 08, but these faults have been reported for much longer.
vii. 23 Claremont Road street light replaced Mar 07 but not yet operational; promised by eDF for 16 Mar 08. Your ref. 92014836 allocated on 8 Feb 08.
viii. See also 92013782 allocated on 7 Jan 08 because of Councillor Munro's visit.
ix. Church Road, sign for humps at the Village Hall is unlit
8. Village Design Statement
Cllr Sheppard has drafted a policy element for this Committee to be enshrined in the VDS. It was circulated and comments made, so now it is in second draft; Draft B. It was circulated on 24 Mar 2008 and needs approval. If no more comments are received, Cllr Sheppard will send the document to Noel Isaacs. Post meeting note; further circulated on 22 May
Cllr Herbert stated the overall document structure of the VDS needs to be decided. Once this style is agreed all submissions may need to be redrafted. We are still awaiting new appointments of Officers at EBC to deal with the Local Development Framework
9. Parking
a. Off-Street Parking Charges
No action this period.
b. On-Street Issues
Surrey C.C. responses outstanding
10. Traffic Calming
10.1 Re AP67. Traffic calming. Cllr Huddart put our proposals to Malcolm, and he to his panel. Although there is probably majority support, other damaging views have come in. There is a hard core of those against any vertical deflection measures (humps, cushions and tables). There are now views coming from Oaken Lane that taking any action in Hare Lane will divert traffic to Oaken Lane. Although this is unlikely to be the case to a significant extent, the expression of these views makes it impossible to take a scheme to SCC saying that the CPC has an effective consensus to make it worth proceeding on a scheme that will be expensive and contentious for SCC
Cllr Huddart also displayed the proposals at the Parish meeting, but there was no effective response.
It was agreed that both Cllr Huddart and Malcolm had put a great deal of hard work into the scheme and that it would be a shame to see it fail now. The meeting endorsed the previous proposals.
10.2 Cllr Parks would like to see Claygate as a ‘safety village’, with a long-term strategy to encourage cycling and reduce traffic speeds.
10.3 Caroline Stevenson noted that the village of Peasdown St. John has erected advisory 20mph signs. These are not mandatory, so do not need traffic orders. It is believed that they have had the effect of slowing the traffic. It was agreed that Cllr Huddart would make enquires to ascertain if formal evidence can be obtained.
AP72 Cllr Huddart to action.
10.4 It was noted that attitudes to speed is changing; 2 London Boroughs are trying to make all roads a 20mph limit.
11. Input to the Village Show
It was agreed to include
i. recently resurfaced roads around the village i.e. Raleigh Drive
ii. the proposed traffic calming scheme
iii. the Woodstock triangle-before and after
iv. a request for residents to report over-hanging vegetation with the contact numbers for SCC and EBC
12. Bridleway Proposals & Rights of Way
Nothing to report.
13. Street Signage
During the Claygate Clean-up, the street nameplate for Coverts Road had all the debris removed from the base, but the sign needs washing. There are many dirty signs around the village. Councillors were asked to report them to Cllr Huddart. The sign for High Street by the side of Il Corallo is worn out.
AP73 Cllrs to report to Cllr Huddart
AP74 Cllr Huddart to collate and report to EBC
14. Website
Cllr Huddart will provide the traffic calming papers for the website.
AP75 Cllr Huddart to action
15. Matters for Information Only
None
16. Date and place of the next meeting
The next meeting will be at 8.00pm on 17 July 2008 in the Village Hall Committee Room.
Signed………………………………………………..as a true and fair record of the meeting. Date……………………………